i need some emotional support & guidance

[girlrvr]

hello everyone.

 

ok. so, yes, life with an LR.

 

after shaver, i realized there was just way too much slack in the drivetrain.

i brought it cerrone's in RWC yesterday and here's the prognosis:

 

1) front diff entirely fkd. oil full of metal bits. was so bad i was not allowed to drive it back to SF. left it there. took the train home.

2) went in primarily to check the t-case. frank said it is pretty much also fkd and needs to be replaced.

3) seems like something is also going on with the clutch - not sure if it's the pressure plates or the disc is worn but at this point since the tcase is off, might as well replace it.

4) concerned that maybe the output shaft of the tranny may also be shot. won't know until the tcase is off.

5) 2nd gear sticky-ness may indicate the tranny synchro is also fkd. he's gonna drain the tranny fluid to see how much crap is in it and assess whether that needs to be replaced, too.

 

to do the front diff, pull/replace tcase (with a decent used one) is already $4500ish.

omfg.

 

if the tranny also needs to be replaced add (1) time to find a good manual tranny and (2) about another $2k.

 

so, yeah, i'm dying here. i was literally lying on the floor completely overwhelmed by this .... :-/

 

i have no idea what i should do.

 

here are my options as i see them:

 

option ( a ) stop now. file the VINs off and push it off a cliff (take off what's reusable) and with the same amount of money find another D1 (of even D2).

 

option ( b ) keep going. get it all up to snuff and be done with it. because no matter what rig i buy, i will have more problems. a case of "the devil you

know is better than the devil you don't"

 

somebody help me !!!! aaaarrrrrgghhh !!!!

 

 

any and all inputs is welcome. 

thanks guys!

[foster]

I'm a big fan of 'the devil you know' line of thought...it's part of the LR charm! Otherwise, we might as well all be driving Tacomas or something. Yuck.

 

$4500 is a lot of money to put into a $4500 truck, but then you know those components are sorted out. And you can't put a price on the "cool factor" of that 3rd pedal! I do worry about the possible scarcity of good manual transmissions though... 

[Elherbinator]

hello everyone.

 

ok. so, yes, life with an LR.

 

after shaver, i realized there was just way too much slack in the drivetrain.

i brought it cerrone's in RWC yesterday and here's the prognosis:

 

1) front diff entirely fkd. oil full of metal bits. was so bad i was not allowed to drive it back to SF. left it there. took the train home.

2) went in primarily to check the t-case. frank said it is pretty much also fkd and needs to be replaced.

3) seems like something is also going on with the clutch - not sure if it's the pressure plates or the disc is worn but at this point since the tcase is off, might as well replace it.

4) concerned that maybe the output shaft of the tranny may also be shot. won't know until the tcase is off.

5) 2nd gear sticky-ness may indicate the tranny synchro is also fkd. he's gonna drain the tranny fluid to see how much crap is in it and assess whether that needs to be replaced, too.

 

to do the front diff, pull/replace tcase (with a decent used one) is already $4500ish.

omfg.

 

if the tranny also needs to be replaced add (1) time to find a good manual tranny and (2) about another $2k.

 

so, yeah, i'm dying here. i was literally lying on the floor completely overwhelmed by this .... :-/

 

i have no idea what i should do.

 

here are my options as i see them:

 

option (a) stop now. file the VINs off and push it off a cliff (take off what's reusable) and with the same amount of money find another D1 (of even D2).

 

option ( keep going. get it all up to snuff and be done with it. because no matter what rig i buy, i will have more problems. a case of "the devil you

know is better than the devil you don't"

 

somebody help me !!!! aaaarrrrrgghhh !!!!

 

 

any and all inputs is welcome.

thanks guys!

Bummer to hear, never fun news to get. If your go the repair route, I would try to scrounge parts from donor vehicles. Unless you aren’t running stock gears, getting a new third for the front axle should be cheap and easy. That would be an easy wrench day type of job. I don’t see how driving it in its current condition would make things worse, so I wouldn’t hesitate to grab it from the shop and drive it. Maybe take the front drive shaft off and lock the cdl. The transfer case can also be sourced pretty easily. The transmission is a different story. You’re probably better off getting it rebuilt, but I’m not sure what that would run. Another option for repair is to upgrade at the same time. I’m referring to the axles. If you need to scrap your front diff anyways, it isn’t a bad time to regear both and add a locker and possibly larger tires. If that was at all in the future plans, this would be a good time to do it.

If it were me, and I wasn’t too emotionally attached to the vehicle, I would probably call pick n pull and start surfing craigslist. With so many issues going on, it is going to be a long process to get it right and likely other issues will pop up. Used disco’s in good shape can be found for cheap. Built ones can also be found, but are pretty rare. Several built discos come up for sale every year, but many of them want way too much. It’s a tough call, but then only way I think repairing will work financially is if you do it yourself and find used parts.

 

 

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[astateofmike]

This is tough. Love my classic, but 4450 in repairs I will have to consider getting rid of it and putting money somewhere else...(gasp) a Land Cruiser or into my VW.. something I can still get parts for easily

 

So, my suggestion. Is the Disco/manual trans THE LR you dreamt of? If not, now is the time to look for that one and use that $4500 to get into it.

 

If it is the adventure now you love not the rig, look for the adventure rig you want regardless of marquee

 

Now, if this disco tickles you all the right ways...then it time to sink cash into this rig. Commit to the journey and do it right

 

astateofmike

 

PS. I have this problem all the time as I just found the Land Cruiser for 10 5 that would do everything I needed to do. Or I could sell my classic and put that money into a new engine for my VW which does everything I need it to do. And I had a disco 2 which I bought a 4.6 engine for and then had an accident. I have my 1995 which I had to sell as I need a commuter car. But even though I have no AC and I'm getting horrible mileage for no reason at all the classic is the car I built after I sold my motorcycle and the entire time I've had my little kids and because of that I don't know if I'll ever be able to get rid of it. So I know exactly how the gut-wrenching starts when the repair bills come in

[RedRover]

I don't have much to contribute, other than to say the green D1 is a cool truck... maybe a little less cool when it's unable to leave RWC but still.

[girlrvr]

thanks guys.

i think i am gonna cry.

 

so now the bill is up the $7200 ish because the tranny fluid had some metal bits. and frank suspects the 2nd gear synchro. 

and, as long as the tcase is off, might as well do the tranny bc it's prob gonna die sometime soon anyway.

AB has one for $2300. plus shipping.

 

i do kinda love this rig. it's unique. but then it's not *that unique.

i waffle between "omg am i really gonna spend that much money on this fkg car" to "omg, even if i do find another one, how much hell will that bring me?"

 

at $7200, you all would likely pull the plug on it, right?

[girlrvr]

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/search/sss?query=Land%20Rover%20Discovery

 

hahahah

[Elherbinator]

You could do the front diff and tcase for well under $1000 if you find some used ones, and they are out there. And the labor can be done in a day. I’d call some transmission shops and price out a rebuild. $7200 is nuts, but avoidable for sure. I’d be surprised if you couldn’t do it for under half that

 

 

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[Elherbinator]

Plus, if you have a shop rebuild the tranny, they have to remove the tcase anyways so you can just have them put back on a newer one.

 

 

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[AdvRovr]

That's a bummer to have all of those hit at once, but t-cases are pretty commonly available for cheap, and diffs are available all day long for almost nothing. The transmission is the only tricky bit. The good news is that the t-case and tranny aren't too hard to do at once, and you'd have to do the removal to do the clutch anyway, so it's really not such a big deal. 

 

My advice: take a few days to sleep on it, let the initial shock wash over and wash away. Then, with a clear head, think about the best way to tackle all of those and compare your options. Like Eric said, I think you can do it for much less. 

[astateofmike]

Just some quick thoughts here.  D1, right?

 

So, std 24 spline differentials, yes?  Land Rover Newark has a 1998 D1 (stock looking) right now:   Came in on Feb 7th.  Diffs are pretty easy to get out.  Rear, as he wheels will be off anyway super simple. 

 

Diff?  Is it an LT230?  Now may be the time!  You could reach out to Nathan on NCLR ask if he is selling one for the project.  Might as well be CDL if you are going to do this.

 

Heck, this 1995 is $500 for a working rig with cosmetic issues?  https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/d/1995-land-rover-discovery/6504978860.html 

 

BUY IT.  We can get almost all the parts off of this you need (minus the transmission)....for $500 and some beer money.....it's in Oakland.  Heck looks like the one I see by my office sometimes... Steel rims?  Heck, we can strip it all and have a roller still...geez, simple.

 

You can have all parts you need for $500 in theory, minus transmission.  And when done, have Pick N Pull come get it.

[astateofmike]

Do you have to drive this every day?

 

If not, can we call upon the DHappel to be the source for the space to rebuild?  Has shop. Has Lift. Has D1 Experience.  

 

Seems like this could be a fun club build....but you buy parts, and beer...GOOD beer....

[erinw.rrc]

Jeanne,

 

My love!  I know this truck is special to you... heck, you went all the way to Florida to get it and drive it home.  I know how you feel though... when I got back from the rally, I was told my LR4 was totaled.  I sat at my desk at work, crying, nauseous... I think you're emotional because the truck means something to you.  If it didn't, it would be an easy decision to scrap it.  I paid a lot to fix Captain Jack and well, let's just say I could've had my truck almost paid off with that money.  Boo.  

 

It's not my money, so of course it's easier for me to say pay for it.... but I know how much we spent on RedRover over the last four years, and it's probably more than the truck is worth, but sentimentally, worth every penny.  

 

It may be worth sourcing the parts though as Mike mentioned and having a weekly wrenching days until we get it up and running again.  

[AdvRovr]

 

 

when I got back from the rally, I was told my LR4 was totaled. I sat at my desk at work, crying, nauseous... I think you're emotional because the truck means something to you. If it didn't, it would be an easy decision to scrap it. I paid a lot to fix Captain Jack and well, let's just say I could've had my truck almost paid off with that money. Boo.

Wait, what? Not to thread jack, but what happened to the Capn?

 

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[erinw.rrc]

Wait, what? Not to thread jack, but what happened to the Capn?

 

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I have been recovering from the rally (both physically and financially) and the pain in my pocket book, so hadn't been ready to share.  I can share now and will post in a separate thread as not to hi-jack this one.  

[lithium1330]

Do you have to drive this every day?

 

If not, can we call upon the DHappel to be the source for the space to rebuild?  Has shop. Has Lift. Has D1 Experience.  

 

Seems like this could be a fun club build....but you buy parts, and beer...GOOD beer....

 

Oh, is this why DHappel is hosting shop day this Sunday?

 

 

 

Jeanne, sorry to hear of this news. Argh! So frustrating!

I don’t have much more to add on top of what others have recommended in terms of rebuild/donor truck options.

I feel at the end of this, you should write a book on your journey with LR.

You can title it something like: Zen and the Art of Land Rover Maintenance.

I think it would be quite fitting to write about exploring the struggle and conflicted feelings of owning a Land Rover.

Do it as a sequel to Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance.

 

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/cto/d/lifted-2000-land-rover/6485525438.html

Trail ready with 33’s and service record.

 

As someone else mentioned, take a break, clear your mind and go from there.

G’ luck!

[girlrvr]

Just some quick thoughts here.  D1, right?

 

So, std 24 spline differentials, yes?  Land Rover Newark has a 1998 D1 (stock looking) right now:   Came in on Feb 7th.  Diffs are pretty easy to get out.  Rear, as he wheels will be off anyway super simple. 

 

Diff?  Is it an LT230?  Now may be the time!  You could reach out to Nathan on NCLR ask if he is selling one for the project.  Might as well be CDL if you are going to do this.

 

Heck, this 1995 is $500 for a working rig with cosmetic issues?  https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/d/1995-land-rover-discovery/6504978860.html 

 

BUY IT.  We can get almost all the parts off of this you need (minus the transmission)....for $500 and some beer money.....it's in Oakland.  Heck looks like the one I see by my office sometimes... Steel rims?  Heck, we can strip it all and have a roller still...geez, simple.

 

You can have all parts you need for $500 in theory, minus transmission.  And when done, have Pick N Pull come get it.

 

 

yeah, this rig is $500. have been in touch with the seller and may look at it tomorrow.

how would i tell if tcase and diffs are ok? as long as there is no major clunking, i'll presume they are better than the ones i have currently?!?! hahaha

 

i called a tranny shop here in SF and they said they can't rebuild my tranny bc they can't get parts. i have no idea what that means. 

 

anyway, i will sleep on it some and hopefully some clarity will come to me.

 

thank you all so much for your input and help !!! 

[girlrvr]

there is also this: and it's a manual transmission!

 

https://merced.craigslist.org/cto/d/1996-land-rover-discovery-se7/6484615367.html

[GraemeWare]

Jeanne,

 

Okay, so assuming you have standard gearing, I have a standard "third" (otherwise known as a differential) sitting here in a bucket that I was going to throw away. It was absolutely fine, just removed when I put in my Ashcroft TBD in Katrina.

 

All parts for the manual box are available, almost without exception. We either have them, or can get them.

 

Transfer cases are easy and plentiful. I may even have one in the shed (and giving it away is easier than transporting it 250 miles later this year).

 

The diff is easy to do yourself (I do mine in the street outside my house!). Transfer case is easier with a two post lift ....

 

And who cares if there is no synchro? Katrina hasn't had synchro for years; you learn to rev match and double-declutch.

 

I'd have the oil refilled in all the items, get them to swap the diff to make it driveable (if it won't drive 5 miles to my place) and work on a long-term plan.

 

And the clutch might be as simple as a slave cylinder. What are the symptoms?

 

Regards,

 

Graeme

[Jethro]

So I've done the differential swap and was straight forward Solo on the garage floor.

 

There are stock units on eBay for few $$ or you can consider upgrading.

 

Jason has done the work on his manual and can chime in but don't think it was terribly hard. Remember him talking about having to rebuild and swap clutches.

 

Reality is the labor kills and buying anything from Atlantic British or rovers north just adds to it.

 

LR direct carries same product for half price. I actually think they buy from them then double price plus add shipping.

 

Possibly consider a second opinion from Collin or Alex?

 

But definitely have learned the hard way really only way to afford these is diy as much as you can.

 

 

 

 

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[astateofmike]

Ok. Jeanne the decision has been made. Unless you have some objection.

 

Get the truck out of Cerrones and up to Graeme. Then we get the new diff in. And as many parts as needed in the back. Then to Collins for a 2nd opinion. Then cm Don and ask about a wrench party and some storage time.

 

We can rebuild. Better than it was before: better, stronger, faster

[girlrvr]

Jeanne,

 

Okay, so assuming you have standard gearing, I have a standard "third" (otherwise known as a differential) sitting here in a bucket that I was going to throw away. It was absolutely fine, just removed when I put in my Ashcroft TBD in Katrina.

 

All parts for the manual box are available, almost without exception. We either have them, or can get them.

 

Transfer cases are easy and plentiful. I may even have one in the shed (and giving it away is easier than transporting it 250 miles later this year).

 

The diff is easy to do yourself (I do mine in the street outside my house!). Transfer case is easier with a two post lift ....

 

And who cares if there is no synchro? Katrina hasn't had synchro for years; you learn to rev match and double-declutch.

 

I'd have the oil refilled in all the items, get them to swap the diff to make it driveable (if it won't drive 5 miles to my place) and work on a long-term plan.

 

And the clutch might be as simple as a slave cylinder. What are the symptoms?

 

Regards,

 

Graeme

 

Hi Graeme! Thanks for the info and support! I am starting to feel better about this all.

Yes, standard gearing.

and your line "and who cares if you have no synchro" cracked me right up !!!! 

[girlrvr]

Ok. Jeanne the decision has been made. Unless you have some objection.

 

Get the truck out of Cerrones and up to Graeme. Then we get the new diff in. And as many parts as needed in the back. Then to Collins for a 2nd opinion. Then cm Don and ask about a wrench party and some storage time.

 

We can rebuild. Better than it was before: better, stronger, faster

 

awww, guys. you are the bestest of the bestest-es. really. i am so touched!

 

i LOVE that fact that you came up with a plan already. 

and, yes, i am down with the plan.

 

i was planning on picking up the truck from cerrones tomorrow morning.

can i come by after that, graeme?

if not, lmk what time works.

 

and i am def in for supplying beer (good beer). i have a friend who runs a microbrewery up here in SF and will get ample supplies for wrenching days and anything else :-)

 

and we can rebuild her faster, better. as long as she doesn't end up costing $6 million ... right? ;-)

[lithium1330]

i bet at the end of this saga... there is gonna be a joke about how many LR owners does it take to change a light bulb.  

 

Jeanne... looks like you got the whole club backing your corner... that's pretty rad! 

[astateofmike]

You need to set a budget so the plan can evolve

 

Otherwise you end up owning a Unimog because you told me "i bet you cant find me one in CA...."

 

I digress, thats a whole different story.

 

So lets get a list:

 

Differential.

Diff carrier.

Axles?

Tcase? Lt230 why not?

Clutch stuff....

 

Where is this list we need..